Can bacteriostatic antibiotics cause herxes?

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Can bacteriostatic antibiotics cause herxes?

Post by Martian » Tue 2 Oct 2007 18:41

Can both bacteriostatic antibiotics (e.g. tetracyclines and macrolides) and bacteriocidal antibiotics (e.g. penicillins and cephalosporins) cause herxheimer-reactions, or can only bacteriocidal antibiotics cause that?

I can image that there is at least a difference in severity (bacteriocidal antibiotics a faster and more severe effect, I suspect), because of the different mode of action. But bacteriostatic antibiotics can also kill bacteria at higher concentrations. So couldn't these antibiotics also cause herxes?

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Re: Can bacteriostatic antibiotics cause herxes?

Post by Nick » Wed 3 Oct 2007 12:59

according to the official definition of a herxheimer reaction this is not possible or very unlikely.

However, we know that many Lyme treatments can (sometimes) cause effects that are similar to herxheimer reactions. This is reported for some alternative treatments like cat's claw/samento, certain 'detox' products and even for rifing etc. Maybe these 'herxing' effects are mostly caused by increased immune activity as a result of the treatment? (and not by toxic remains of dead bacteria).

I would like to see someone really check if Bb bacteria are dying with any of these treatments (including bacteriocidic and bacteriostatic AB products). It should be possible to check for Bb remains in the urine over a course of several days before/after treatment, and there should be some kind of correlation between the 'herxing' and (increase of) bacterial die-off products. I have never seen any direct proof that Bb is dying as a result of antibiotics.

Also, I think the definition of bacteriocidic / bacteriostatic is problematic with parasites that move out of the bloodstream and into tissues/cells; it is very difficult to determine AB concentrations inside certain body fluids (like the brain) or inside cells. And because the environment in these places can be vastly different, the concept of a deadly or inhibiting AB concentration may be unworkable. Also, metabolic activity of the patient and many other factors will influence actual AB concentrations in certain parts of the body, maybe sometimes the AB accumulate locally to reach a deadly level?

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